Ken Miller in Ohio -- UPDATED

Once is not enough! ;)

Once is not enough! ;)

— Henry J

test dfhfth dfhgfhn dfghdfg

yes

[Collect all 7!]

Anyone care to publish a 7-part series online?

;-)

Good for Miller. Dawkins really despises him, though.

Does that say something about Miller?

Or Dawkins?

Got a cite for "despises" as against "disagrees with"?

It says the most about Dawkins. What has Miller done to offend Dawkins?

Of course, since Dawkins has shown his willingness to trash millions of innocent people without regard to their actions -- or even a clear understanding of their beliefs -- why should we care what Dawkins "thinks?"

I once heard Ken Miller tell a story about a, um, vigorous (impromptu) debate they once had when they were both invited to the same dinner or something. I don't remember the details unfortunately, but neither Miller nor Dawkins are exactly slouches when it comes to witty repartee.

Got a cite for "despises" as against "disagrees with"?

— hiero5ant

grady just loves dropping one-line strawmen as bait.

By CORNELIA DEAN Published: October 26, 2006 In an unusual foray into electoral politics, 75 science professors at Case Western Reserve University in Cleveland have signed a letter endorsing a candidate for the Ohio Board of Education. The professors' favored candidate is Tom Sawyer, a former congressman and onetime mayor of Akron. They hope Mr. Sawyer, a Democrat, will oust Deborah Owens Fink, a leading advocate of curriculum standards that encourage students to challenge the theory of evolution. Elsewhere in Ohio, scientists have also been campaigning for candidates who support the teaching of evolution and have recruited at least one biologist from out of state to help.

So far, Miller is doing his usual bangup job. Ms. Fink really "finked" around some questions about the critical analysis issue.
Dr. Williams is also rather special. He said that in the business community people are more "open-minded" to good ideas. Too bad ID hasn't yielded s*** in research for the business world. Lots of book sales. No R&D.

I'm listening to it on the radio: it is a superb treatment. Miller is doing a fantastic job, and Tom Sawyer is doing a fine political wrap-up near the end.

Michelle Goldberg to Speak in Overland Park Mainstream Voices of Faith will co-sponsor a talk by Michelle Goldberg, author of Kingdom Coming: The Rise of Christian Nationalism on Sunday, November 12 . There will be a brunch at 9:30 am, the program begins at 10:30. To attend, make reservations by November 3rd by calling or stopping by the Jewish Community Center, 5801 W. 115th St., Overland Park, KS. 913-327-8000. Cost is $12 per person. Goldberg's lecture will introduce you to the leaders behind the rise of Christian extremism in America, and give a how-to guide for preserving religious and civil liberties against the religious right. Goldberg will be available after the presentation to sign copies of her book.

OK, so at this point I'm provisionally going with "'Dawkins despises Miller' is unfounded tendentious nonsense," subject to future correction.

Will the Miller webcast be archived anywhere?

Dr. Miller has received a good deal of grief of late from those who should know better.

These critics have lambasted him here and at other blogs for, among other things, having a peculiarly theistic take on evolution.

Talk about biting the hand that feeds you. Few people have been such a tireless advocate for evolution education. I'd like to see my friends in the community of the godless who have been so critical of Miller put either their time or their money on the line in the Ohio elections. Let's come together, people!....SH

The youtube thing has been taken down due to copyright infringement.

Dawknin's no more despises people who hold sincere religious belief than Millar despises Atheists. He probably doesn't have a lot of time for those that wish to exploit that belief and those in the religious industry who want to indoctrinate kids to improve their market share.

Miller is seriously good - I almost wish that there was a Catholic God as a reward for all his efforts. He was much better than Dawkins on the 'Colbert Report' - Dawkins seemed rather bemused by the whole thing, although at least he smiled a lot for a change.

When Dawkins was here in Kansas he ridiculed both Miller and Gould for being accomodating to religion.

You all know that is Dawkins attitude.

Quit pretending.

I of course cannot speak for others, but I can say with all honesty and sincerity that I am not "pretending".

I'm just asking for a citation that demonstrates that Dawkins "despises" Miller. Have you any?

We should distinguish between antiscientific and religious sentiments wherever we can, despite the conflation from creationists. This also makes it natural to criticise Miller's theistic evolution as it is.

If we need to compare Colbert's interviews of Miller vs Dawkins instead of what they are saying, I think it is hard to say who come off better, since it is also a matter of taste involved - personally I enjoyed Dawkins' spare and witty style, which influences me apart from that I agree with Dawkins' worldview and disagree with Miller's.

I think Miller come over as smoother and at least as sure of himself, especially since Dawkins had a wobbly start before adapting to the format of the show. Miller also parsed his answers admirably. I'm pretty sure he may be the good public speaker everybody says.

But on the other hand Dawkins made Colbert loose the thread at times, perhaps since Colbert seems to be a catholic and have opposed views which must have made it hard for him when Dawkins returned strong points.

So IMO both made a good job on their points. And Colbert was terrific too - the format he uses is personally friendly and fun while intellectually provocative, exactly the devious style that one may think is needed to reach some groups.

When Dawkins was here in Kansas he ridiculed both Miller and Gould for being accomodating to religion.

I watched the speech. He didn't "ridicule" Miller or Gould. Sure, he strongly disagrees with their positions, even calling NOMA "nonsense", but there were no personal attacks. Actually, I think he's fairly polite. He could be a lot nastier, if he wanted to be.

— jeffw

OK, so at this point I'm provisionally going with "'Dawkins despises Miller' is unfounded tendentious nonsense," subject to future correction.

Well, your citation which conclusively disproves the claim that Dawkins "despises" Miller may have truth on its side, but the idea that atheists must be snivelling bigoted hate-filled golblins has truthiness.

It says the most about Dawkins. What has Miller done to offend Dawkins?

Gee, Popper, it sure was quiet while you were gone.

What, and it suddenly changed? I see, Lenny, that you're as intellectually dishonest and as much of a dick waver as I remember you to be.

Ken Miller - On Apes and Humans
http://beepbeepitsme.blogspot.com/2006/11/ken-miller-on-apes-and-humans.html