Obama for President!

Posted 25 October 2006 by Jeffrey Shallit

OK, maybe I'm jumping the gun, and The Panda's Thumb is not a politics blog. But it is really refreshing to hear a national politician say forthrightly that "Evolution is more grounded in my experience than angels." For more about Barack Obama, visit here.

22 Comments

normdoering · 25 October 2006

Glad to hear it, but there's another side to Obama some here might have a problem with:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kirsten-powers/obama-and-the-god-factor_b_32362.html

He's still promising, but wait and watch and learn. We don't know everything yet.

Sounder · 25 October 2006

Normally I don't care enough about the Obama to like or dislike him; he just seemed like a marrionette that the Democratic Party was polishing for bigger venues. This is actually something that I can notice and respect: it's very ballsy for a politician to take a stance on a sensitive topic like evolution.

gwangung · 25 October 2006

Obsidian Wings has a nice little featurette on what Obama's done in Congress.

http://obsidianwings.blogs.com/obsidian_wings/2006/10/barack_obama.html#comment-24365388

It strikes me as competent and workmanlike, which is in stark contrast to most Congresscritters these days. His comment on evolution seems to me to be the least of his virtues.

MarkP · 25 October 2006

He can believe in whatever gods he likes as long as he keeps them out of science classes and out of his legislative decisions.

Peter · 25 October 2006

I agree that it's really good to see that a man so open about his faith, which has some nuances and intellectual qualities that I can cope with in most instances. He is not a fundie. Far from it. His respect for evidence (evident as a lawyer who once was editor of the Harvard Law Review) is clear and powerful. It's important that he made the distinction that evolution "is more in [his] experience than angels." That's a huge boon to us who respect evidence.

'Rev Dr' Lenny Flank · 25 October 2006

Never voted for a theist for public office, Norm . . . . ?

'Rev Dr' Lenny Flank · 25 October 2006

This is actually something that I can notice and respect: it's very ballsy for a politician to take a stance on a sensitive topic like evolution.

It is, of course, more than Al Gore was willing to do:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/campaigns/wh2000/stories/creation082799.htm Gore Avoids Stance on Creationism By Hanna Rosin Washington Post Staff Writer Friday, August 27, 1999; Page A8 Vice President Gore, known for his love of science education, refused yesterday to take a clear stand on whether public schools should be required to teach evolution and not creationism. Gore and the other candidates running for president have been faced with questions about their position on the teaching of evolution after the Aug. 11 decision by the Kansas Board of Education to wipe out evolution from the statewide science curriculum. The vote is the most decisive victory in recent years for creationists, fundamentalist Christians who believe that God created human beings and animals fully formed, as described in Genesis. When first asked about the Kansas vote, a Gore spokesman seemed to allow for the possibility of teaching creationist science, an option the Supreme Court has ruled out. "The vice president favors the teaching of evolution in public schools," Alejandro Cabrera said yesterday in response to a question from a Reuters reporter. "Obviously, that decision should and will be made at the local level, and localities should be free to teach creationism as well." The Supreme Court has ruled that schools are not free to teach creationism. In 1987, the court ruled in Edwards v. Aguilar that a Louisiana statute prohibiting the teaching of evolution unless creationist science was taught as well improperly endorses religion. After checking the 1987 decision, Cabrera adjusted his statement by saying that Gore supports the teaching of creationism only in certain contexts, such as in a religion class--an option that has not been ruled unconstitutional. The vice president, however, declined to criticize the Kansas school board vote, repeating that the decision to teach evolution should be up to local schools. Prominent scientists felt betrayed by their ally, and detected waffling in Gore's finely tuned answers. "What he's trying to do is carry water on both shoulders," said Daniel Koshland, former editor of the journal Science and a professor at the University of California at Berkeley. "It reflects badly on him that he would say something incorrect in order to appease all parts of the population."

normdoering · 25 October 2006

'Rev Dr' Lenny Flank asked:

Never voted for a theist for public office, Norm .... ?

As you well know, we've never been given that choice in our life time. The closest thing to a non-theist president was probably Lincoln. You're just being a bigot, Lenny. Read the article I linked. I said he was promising but he will be what Sam Harris calls an enabler at the very least. All presidents have to be to get elected these days. There are still things about his religious beliefs that could be a problem if there isn't a better alternative.

'Rev Dr' Lenny Flank · 25 October 2006

You're just being a bigot, Lenny.

Want some cheese to go with that whine, Norm?

normdoering · 25 October 2006

'Rev Dr' Lenny Flank wrote:

Want some cheese to go with that whine, Norm?

No. Want a clue to go with your over used cliches? CLUE: Being a sarcastic asshole on the internet is going out of style.

normdoering · 25 October 2006

'Rev Dr' Lenny Flank wrote:

Want some cheese to go with that whine, Norm?

No. How 'bout you, want a clue to go with your over used cliche? Clue: Being a sarcastic asshole on the internet is going out of style.

iagree · 27 October 2006

I agree with Norm. It is clear that flank ignored the substance of the article and posted what amounted to a knee-jerk reaction. He didn't dare to admit his mistake, and instead tried to insult Norm. He will obviously dismiss any criticisim with a "(shrug)", just like ID-activists like Luskin dismiss any criticism with "(shrug)". Just watch.

Cowardly Disembodied Voice · 27 October 2006

Category I - The Creationist
Religion is Good.
Studying Evolution makes people Atheists.

Category II - The Theistic Evolutionist.
Religion is Good.
Studying Evolution didn't make ME an atheist.

Category III - The Militant Atheist.
Religion is Bad.
Studying evolution OUGHT to make right-thinking people atheists.

normdoering · 27 October 2006

Cowardly Disembodied Voice wrote:

Category III - The Militant Atheist. Religion is Bad. Studying evolution OUGHT to make right-thinking people atheists.

Nope. That's not quite right. It's more like this: Studying evolution OUGHT to make people stop being creationists. Knowing there are thousands of contradictory religious claims in addition to creationism that also can't prove themselves OUGHT to make people distrust religious claims. Knowing God is ultimately just an anthropomorphic and arrogant previliging of human beings in a universe as vast and old as ours OUGHT to make people atheists.

'Rev Dr' Lenny Flank · 27 October 2006

Studying evolution OUGHT to make right-thinking people atheists.

Damn, now Norm is gonna start preaching again . . . . . (sigh)

Bush Sad · 4 November 2006

How come you say that Obama has no experience in handling foreign policy matters?

That is crazy??????

Obama is a product of the US foreign policy: he is local, he is foreign, he is both. I was a friend of his Kenyan father!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Obama is what globalisation is all about.

I will vote him

Bush Sad · 4 November 2006

How come you say that Obama has no experience in handling foreign policy matters? That is crazy?????? Obama is a product of the US foreign policy: he is local, he is foreign, he is both. I was a friend of his Kenyan father!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Obama is what globalisation is all about.

Bush Sad · 4 November 2006

jane · 4 November 2006

Fayne Tucker · 11 December 2006

If you want a genuine, wise and compassionate president look into Obama

Nick · 23 December 2006

You definitely have to see him in person to believe it. I was wavering with the same old questions (too young, too little experience), but he's more of an adult than our last three presidents combined. Funny Obama t-shirt at http://www.kawktees.com