Freshwater: Movement toward a settlement?

The school board should offer this as evidence at the admin hearing. ,Affiant [Hamilton] states as it relates to any of John Freshwater’s testimony that John Freshwater can only testify to what he knows or remembers. Affiant attests that communicating with John Freshwater can be challenging or even frustrating and a questioner must ask John Freshwater very precise questions and give John Freshwater time to think about his answer

Difficulties in communication would seem to be fatal for a teacher.

"The request for reconsideration includes pictures of the split pipe that drowned his laptop computer (Attachment 1) "

What no plumbing repair bills or insurance claims? Also, that's a pretty busy nail to flatten two tires on the same day! Although I suppose he's claiming the second one was his spare. Sigh... He doesn't seem to be prepared for when things don't go his way. And Hamilton doesn't paint a pretty picture of his client's reasoning skills. However it seems Hamilton was waist deep in this murky thinking, and leading the way at that.

Actually, among the attachments to the request is an affidavit from his plumber and various receipts regarding the tire repairs. I haven't read all 7 attachments (I do have a life here somewhere), so there may be more.

I believe in the Federal court system the court orders you to meet for settlement talks. They even have a "settlement" week. So it should be no surprise that they are going to discuss settlement.
I read the plumbers affidavit. No where does it say that he witnessed a damaged computer. Or did I miss this?

In one of the documents Hamilton says he took it to his local computer shop and the guy there couldn't fix it. No mention of specialized data recover firms IIRC.

Joe McFaul said: The school board should offer this as evidence at the admin hearing. ,Affiant [Hamilton] states as it relates to any of John Freshwater’s testimony that John Freshwater can only testify to what he knows or remembers. Affiant attests that communicating with John Freshwater can be challenging or even frustrating and a questioner must ask John Freshwater very precise questions and give John Freshwater time to think about his answer Difficulties in communication would seem to be fatal for a teacher.

The date on the Home Depot receipts say January 2009. That doesn't make any sense. The Federal Case was filed in June 2009 if I'm not mistaken.

There’s one priceless line in Hamilton’s affidavit attached to the request...Client, meet bus.

Legally disgusting. Hamilton's looking more and more like a con man. Freshwater deserves to be fired but the (in)competence of his legal counsel almost makes me feel sorry for him. This guy is going to lose the case, take Freshwater's house, and blame the result on the system. And Freshwater's going to believe him merely because Hamilton professes the same faith.

RBH said: In one of the documents Hamilton says he took it to his local computer shop and the guy there couldn't fix it. No mention of specialized data recover firms IIRC.

RBH said: Actually, among the attachments to the request is an affidavit from his plumber and various receipts regarding the tire repairs. I haven't read all 7 attachments (I do have a life here somewhere), so there may be more.

David said: The date on the Home Depot receipts say January 2009. That doesn't make any sense. The Federal Case was filed in June 2009 if I'm not mistaken.

A relative teaches science at a community college. No wonder she complains the students arrive at college unprepared for science courses. Can't we figure out a way to get better science teachers into high school? (and better textbooks, and I'm sure there are some good science teachers, don't mean to put all in Freshwater's category.)

What would a settlement mean? Surely Freshwater can't have done anything that would motivate a settlement in his favor.

I don't want to express sympathy for either of those shmucks, but I was once in a car that got 2 flat tires at the same time. The road was wet and snowy, and the driver hit an invisible pothole at a relatively high speed. He damaged both rims on the right side of the car, the tires immediately went flat, and we had to abandon the car. Such an event is so unlikely that I can only attribute it to design.

Juicyheart said: The date doesn't matter beyond the fact that it occures between the time Hamilton billed (supposedly) for the affidavits and the time the court required him to hand them over. The fact that the receipts push the document loss so far back is seen as a bonus by Hamilton I'm sure.

Is it kosher for the same judge to be hearing BOTH of Freshwater's federal cases? One in which he is the Plaintiff and the other, he is the defendant.

I just caught that while I was reading through the F v. Board docs.

The more of these documents I read, the more I'm convinced that while Freshwater does not belong in a public school classroom, he got a REALLY crappy attorney in R. Kelley.

Wonder if Hamilton will agree to a reasonable rate of rent for Freshwater to continue to live in his own home?

harold said: What would a settlement mean? Surely Freshwater can't have done anything that would motivate a settlement in his favor.

harold said: What would a settlement mean? Surely Freshwater can't have done anything that would motivate a settlement in his favor.

MememicBottleneck said: ... the two real attorneys he's been assigned from the insurance company want to get rid of this tar baby ...

I'm still trying to figure out what kind of idiot would keep all his business records on a single laptop with no backups. Is he living in 1983? And when he threw the laptop out, was he aware that the hard drive could contain personal data that someone could recover?

Ryan Cunningham said:

Juicyheart said: The date doesn't matter beyond the fact that it occures between the time Hamilton billed (supposedly) for the affidavits and the time the court required him to hand them over. The fact that the receipts push the document loss so far back is seen as a bonus by Hamilton I'm sure.

But shouldn't he at least have some billing records from the time after the laptop was damaged? Are we supposed to assume he just stopped keeping records altogether after his laptop was broken? He has had months to get his billing system in order again. How will he file his taxes? Does Hamilton expect that he can just say, "Oh no! My laptop is fried! I lost my records!" and the judge will reply, "Well, I guess that means you can't be expected to keep any records of anything ever again. We can't continue this trial without them, so we'll all just have to go bowling now."

That guy is so boned.
He should definitely sue his lawyer, and that charlatan that decided to make it an evangelical cause.

John_S said: I'm still trying to figure out what kind of idiot would keep all his business records on a single laptop with no backups. Is he living in 1983? And when he threw the laptop out, was he aware that the hard drive could contain personal data that someone could recover?

I'm sure he can produce billing records authored after Feb 2008 that show he worked on affidavits for Freshwater while HR On Calll was conducting its investigation.

Ok, is this April Fools! Does Hamilton expect Judge Frost to believe that Hamilton's plumber would actually kept the pipe that "allegedly" destroyed his computer for almost 17 months just in case "down the road" a Federal Judge sometime in the future would require Hamilton to show his billing records that were "allegedly" destroyed by "said pipe bursting".

Oh, I don't want to be Hamilton when Judge Frost erupts over this one!

Okay, I'm just going through these quickly and jotting down my thoughts but what lawyer can go without a laptop computer for 16 days, especially when that's "allegedly" where he keeps billing records. Did he not have a job during those 16 days?

Oh, I don't want to be Hamilton when Judge Frost erupts over this one, either!

Did I miss something? I don't remember seeing anything from AAA which would indicate they actually did a pick up and tow. I also find it interesting that the car was dropped off at Walmart at 9:46 but not finished until 11:44. Okay, maybe I'm just suspicious but that seems more like a time frame of someone who had dropped off the car and and actually scheduled to pick it up later.

I don't see where it shows that there was a nail taken from any tire, only that the repairs were for Beed leak.

I know, I know.....maybe I'm jumping to conclusions but once the "black bag" appeared out of no where and considering the circumstances of that fiasco, my mind just seems to go there.

Oh, well, that's enough excitement for tonight!

Matt Young said: I don't want to express sympathy for either of those shmucks, but I was once in a car that got 2 flat tires at the same time.

Thanks again to RBH for his yoeman efforts. I really think that he and Lebo should team-up for a book. This is weirder than Dover.

Joe McFaul, Howdy. We never have had that beer at Dana Point Harbor.

RBH, watching this is all beer and skittles. But what do you envisage as a final outcome as you seem best placed to speculate. Freshwater terminated, sure. However, the federal case can impose what? A jail term? Doudtful. Monetary punishment? He's poor, like Jesus. Asside from termination, and the psychological damage (which i nastilly hope, but doubt, will be great), this wingnut will walk away with god, the UD commentators will ignore it, Bill O'Reilly will be oblivious, and the same state of ignorance will persist; No?

I just want a happier i.e. fry him and his lawyers nuts, ending! Possible?

robert van bakel said: RBH, watching this is all beer and skittles. But what do you envisage as a final outcome as you seem best placed to speculate.

Despite juicebear's explanation I still don't understand the importance of the billing records. What is the relevance to the case of the date of preparation of the affidavits?

As for the pipe burst, how unfortunate that Hamilton's unbacked-up hard disc was slap bang underneath the leak. In the kitchen of all places. Why is Jebus making things so difficult for Freshwater?

Last summer I accidentally dropped this MacBook Pro in the sea. It's still working. But then there are no case-critical notes or records on it so it's not surprising.

Samphire said: Despite juicebear's explanation I still don't understand the importance of the billing records. What is the relevance to the case of the date of preparation of the affidavits?

Samphire said: Despite juicebear's explanation I still don't understand the importance of the billing records. What is the relevance to the case of the date of preparation of the affidavits? As for the pipe burst, how unfortunate that Hamilton's unbacked-up hard disc was slap bang underneath the leak. In the kitchen of all places. Why is Jebus making things so difficult for Freshwater? Last summer I accidentally dropped this MacBook Pro in the sea. It's still working. But then there are no case-critical notes or records on it so it's not surprising.

Thanks again Richard for another excellent report. I have a question about the hearing that you may be able to answer. I
understand that the referee's recommendation is not binding and that the board members may vote however they choose. If Paula Barone recuses herself, there will be four members voting.
We all know that Steve Thompson will vote with Freshwater's side as that is why he ran for the board but what if one of the remaining three members also votes for Freshwater to retain his position? I know that this is extremely unlikely as the three other members all voted to fire Freshwater initially and obviously nothing has come out in the hearing to exonerate Freshwater on ANY of the allegations. But if there were to be a tie, what would happen then?

David said: The date on the Home Depot receipts say January 2009. That doesn't make any sense. The Federal Case was filed in June 2009 if I'm not mistaken.

The fitting that froze and burst cost less than $1.50. If the attorney reimbursed
the plumber for the entire Home Depot bill, he paid for what appears to be a ten pack
of fittings. Add in the pipe, solder, gas and at least one coupling and you have less than $10 in
material.

As far as recovering info from the HDD, if he had attempted to at least hook the
HDD to another computer to retrieve the info, he would have mentioned that in my opinion.
All too convenient. Leaving a laptop for days waiting for the mover is unbelievable. I would bet he carried that laptop at all times. The computer store bill shows a monitor, printer and
possibly some type of computer purchased and another $79 item purchased.

In regards to the two partially flat tires, He could of just added air and continued to the
court house. Easy to let air out of tires. Walmart did not replace the tire but supposedly
removed a nail that looks brand new and added air. I've removed a lot of nails from tires
and all looked damaged to different degrees. Never in that good of condition.

CMB said: Thanks again Richard for another excellent report. I have a question about the hearing that you may be able to answer. I understand that the referee's recommendation is not binding and that the board members may vote however they choose. If Paula Barone recuses herself, there will be four members voting. We all know that Steve Thompson will vote with Freshwater's side as that is why he ran for the board but what if one of the remaining three members also votes for Freshwater to retain his position? I know that this is extremely unlikely as the three other members all voted to fire Freshwater initially and obviously nothing has come out in the hearing to exonerate Freshwater on ANY of the allegations. But if there were to be a tie, what would happen then?

Thanks to RBH & Juicyheart for their replies and my apologies to Juicyheart for the inadvertent name change.

Samphire said: Thanks to RBH & Juicyheart for their replies and my apologies to Juicyheart for the inadvertent name change.

Why would a pipe in an empty property leak when the temperature (according to Ohio weather records) never rose above +0.8 centigrade and then only briefly. Hardly a thaw. Is this a normal thing for Ohio in January - pipes bursting at copper joints and then thawing while the temperature only rises briefly above zero? If so, wouldn't you leave a bit of background heating on if you were intending to be away for a few days? Pipes in ceiling spaces don't burst if the room below has even a modest amount of heating.

If I was the judge I would want to see both a copy of the insurance claim and a copy of the plumber's strangely-unexhibited repair invoice. Wouldn't Hamilton have wanted such evidence in order to put in a claim for damage to his kitchen units and computer equipment? Or can't you insure in Ohio against leaks caused by frozen pipes?

It is interesting that Hamilton met his plumber "after church". Is that intended to imply that as a christian Hamilton must be telling the truth? It clearly isn't so in Freshwater's case. Or that the plumber was also a member of the church and therefore must also be telling the truth? Why did Hamilton bother to mention it? Did he just bump into Cormack in the vestry? Why hadn't he telephoned him or another plumber earlier? After all, this is a leak which had done major damage.

I cannot understand why Hamilton would go down to the shop on a Sunday at a cost to him of $38.91 to buy items which are the sort of standard kit any plumber would have in his bag by the dozen, in this case a 15mm elbow and a straight connector costing 20 cents.

And why the photo of the straight pipe?

Lastly, it is not as though the burst occurred in a cold water pipe. Cormack says that he saw damage caused by hot water. To cause paint damage that must have been pretty hot water. So how come the pipe froze?

I'd better pack and come on over. I'll need to conduct some pretty intensive cross-examination to get to the bottom of all of this. And I could do with $275 an hour what with BP not paying any dividends this year.

Where's Ohio, by the way? :-)

QUOTE Samphire: Where’s Ohio, by the way? :-)

Answer: About 3 miles north of the Creation Museum--as the crow flies

Samphire said: Why would a pipe in an empty property leak when the temperature (according to Ohio weather records) never rose above +0.8 centigrade and then only briefly. Hardly a thaw. Is this a normal thing for Ohio in January - pipes bursting at copper joints and then thawing while the temperature only rises briefly above zero? If so, wouldn't you leave a bit of background heating on if you were intending to be away for a few days? Pipes in ceiling spaces don't burst if the room below has even a modest amount of heating. If I was the judge I would want to see both a copy of the insurance claim and a copy of the plumber's strangely-unexhibited repair invoice. Wouldn't Hamilton have wanted such evidence in order to put in a claim for damage to his kitchen units and computer equipment? Or can't you insure in Ohio against leaks caused by frozen pipes? It is interesting that Hamilton met his plumber "after church". Is that intended to imply that as a christian Hamilton must be telling the truth? It clearly isn't so in Freshwater's case. Or that the plumber was also a member of the church and therefore must also be telling the truth? Why did Hamilton bother to mention it? Did he just bump into Cormack in the vestry? Why hadn't he telephoned him or another plumber earlier? After all, this is a leak which had done major damage. I cannot understand why Hamilton would go down to the shop on a Sunday at a cost to him of $38.91 to buy items which are the sort of standard kit any plumber would have in his bag by the dozen, in this case a 15mm elbow and a straight connector costing 20 cents. And why the photo of the straight pipe? Lastly, it is not as though the burst occurred in a cold water pipe. Cormack says that he saw damage caused by hot water. To cause paint damage that must have been pretty hot water. So how come the pipe froze?

and anti freeze is put in the toilets.

"George (the rep from the computer repair place) was unable to repair the computer or get the computer to work."

QUOTE Samphire: Where’s Ohio, by the way? :-) Answer: About 3 miles north of the Creation Museum–as the crow flies.

It's wonderful to read intelligent educated conversation. Tomorrow, I'll be back listening to Hamilton's version of questioning at the hearing again.....*sigh*......

Hopefully, tomorrow will be the last day of this ridiculous hearing fiasco.....at least this part......again.....*sigh*.......

Wow, he sat in Wal-Mart for two hours while he was supposed to be in court? Did he watch a DVD while he was there?

jswise said: Wow, he sat in Wal-Mart for two hours while he was supposed to be in court? Did he watch a DVD while he was there?

With that description, he's kind of throwing freshwater under a very short bus, at that.

In the final hearing, Hamilton's physical behavior was very telling. Although he sat beside John Freshwater at the table, he spent 80% of the time (when not involved in questioning witnesses) with his back to John, staring rigidly to the front of the room.

From my observation there appears to be great disharmony between Hamilton and Freshwater. Body language and physical gestures have been quite interesting to observe during this hearing.

To clarify, I should have said in the final day of the hearing.......